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mtnduman
TeamWarfare Vet
TWL Retired Staff
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| 11-06-2009 04:43 PM / profile
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Without gun swapping it's just a ten man pub. I've played a few scrims like this and it was the worst thing that I have done in GG. You also have to remember that every team in the top ten banded together and committed to dropping the ladder if this rule was enacted. We could do this for the new ladder if it's what the community wants.
Snizz I just don't see where you are coming from. As I see it long guns(ak,colt,aug,sig) mean you one thing and that's camp for most teams. I've not been on a team that wants to camp, but from many matches the better the guns the other team gets the less they will move.
Edit:
Originally posted by: snizz.
Just saying Mtn, sheesh, super serious face all the time.
I wasn't trying to be all that serious, but CS> 
Post edited by mtnduman at 11/6/2009 4:47:29 PM
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Darthman
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 05:10 PM / profile
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I say Create the Reverse Ladder, it can only Help the GG community. ICEMAZ has a point to Gripe with the Different GamePlay, but Normal GG has its problems too. Start the New Ladder with all the Rules as the Old one, it shouldn't be that Difficult, and it may even Populate rather Quickly.
As for my real Stance on the Comp. GG Scene... I want a LEAGUE. This is where all the Thinking and Man/Server Power should be working towards.
That's all I want to say.
- .bade
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The Ender
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 07:46 PM / profile
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I've always noticed the matches get more campy once people start getting to rifles, so I don't understand how starting on rifles is going to make it less campy. If a guy on the opposite team gets ahead, all you have to do is sit back to make sure that he doesn't level as you will always have the advantage at range. IMO, this will actually be more of a detriment to the skilled teams than starting on pistols.
Random gun order... interesting. Would the gun order just be randomly set before the match, and everyone followed the same gun order? Or would it actually be completely random and everyone would have a different rotation? I think it would only work if people followed the same order.
Anyway.. I do think something needs to happen to get matches over with quicker. There is no way to enforce a rule against camping, and it is unlikely the community will accept a rule against gun swapping right away. I think a test ladder that incorporates a "No Swapping" rule would be more progressive in finding a way to eliminate 1+ hour matches.
Another idea I think would work is knifer's having a flash grenade. People wouldn't be able to camp a corner that's impossible to get to without being picked. It would force people attempting to avoid being knifed to move instead of staying in one spot that's easily covered. Everyone knows that a half decent player could hold his own against 2 knifers and three gunners with full health if he had an AK or any rifle up top on towers. I don't know where anyone could safely camp on any map if a flash grenade is in play.
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 07:57 PM / profile
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Ehhh on the flash, but what about a glock...?
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 08:05 PM / profile
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I don't know how else to explain this, lol, other than scrimming against you and sitting you down in .53 seconds.
My whole basis is NOT about camping. No, not at all. What I am saying is gun game is no so much a test of skill. Far from it. As I mentioned, a shitty team can get ROLLED in gun game. But when nade and knife become the issue, the shitty team can EASILY catch up and sometimes win. That's MY PERSONAL problem with gun game.
How do we solve that without the following the command:
rcon es_unload gungame4
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The Ender
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 08:18 PM / profile
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Snizz, we sat the best team you were ever a part of in 2, and we did it fairly quickly on towers which is one of the campiest maps in GunGame.
How will glock solve the problem of someone camping the corner? Do you run faster with it out? Does it make it so people can't hit you? Are you invisible with it? I don't understand how a glock will solve the problem better than a flash grenade, especially when you're left as knifer you normally have picked up a fallen gun anyway.
You're attempting to solve issues that didn't exist before skilled teams arrived in the ladder, which means skilled teams are a cause of those issues. You have never been on a skilled team, therefor do not understand the intricacies of where these problems come from. I am sorry for getting offensive, but I can only take someone talking about something they don't understand for so long before getting annoyed.
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The Ender
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 08:30 PM / profile
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I should probably make it clear that I am for the Reverse GG Ladder, and we would definitely participate. Well, maybe not me personally since my ISP is retarded.. but as soon as that's figured out, for sure.
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 08:50 PM / profile
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Welcome to world of opinions. I am stating my opinions. If they make you upset, the internet is not for you.
My comment about "sitting" you was a joke. I am not a GG pro. You sir need someone to talk to. This is a thread I began to have people come post their opinions. Please don't flame me for having them.
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Sick Shot
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 09:42 PM / profile
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^^lmaoo
I want my mom!
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 10:11 PM / profile
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^
This ladder is reserved for people on an active team, on any ladder and for people who enjoy PARTICIPATING in matches.
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Sick Shot
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 10:51 PM / profile
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Come on maaaan. Please don't flame maaaan.
Pleaaaase.
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-06-2009 10:53 PM / profile
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Lol.
Anyways, reverse gun game.
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PrinceofHonor
TeamWarfare Vet
Retired Sr. Staff
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| 11-07-2009 08:32 AM / profile
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Stay on topic, snizz, just because you posted an idea doesn't mean that it is your ladder. Also just because you started a post doesn't make it your post, this is a community discussion all things relevant should be posted. Also once again I want to state that we are working on this ladder and it should be out shortly.
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-07-2009 10:52 AM / profile
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EDIT: BIT MY LIP
Post edited by snizz. at 11/7/2009 10:58:36 AM
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Sick Shot
TWL Member
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| 11-07-2009 12:00 PM / profile
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The ladder will help out GunGame...
There will still be camping.
Random is better in my opinion, but the rotation has to change everytime.
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Shartfire #RAGE
TWL Member
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| 11-07-2009 02:31 PM / profile
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@sickshot
stop trolling, voice your opinion on reverse or gtfo
@everyone else that's interested
This comes straight from gg_en_config.cfg on fab's match server:
//
// Randomize weapon order at each mapchange
// 0= no, 1= yes
gg_random_weapon_order 0
That is to say, that the weapon order for the server would be randomized, not per team or per player.
IMO: Random would be cool, as would reverse. I'm game for either and I think most of my team would agree and participate as well. Thanks PoH for getting the ball moving and snizz (and everyone) for starting this and keeping it moving.
Keep it up!
Post edited by Spitfire? at 11/7/2009 2:33:21 PM
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The Ender
TWL Member
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| 11-07-2009 05:01 PM / profile
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I really like that idea, Spitfire. Admittedly, if there were two different ladders we would likely take the original one a little more seriously, but it would still be very fun to play with random order. And fun is key, neh?
Also, I'm not sure if another thread should be started for this.. but I think a discussion on ways to solve the issue of matches lasting over an hour should be addressed. I've had discussions with people about this before, so I know there is concern about it, but I think a more formal discussion is needed so everyone is on the same page and we have more opinions about it. I think maybe some people are scared that if we start pushing for shorter matches that gun switching will no longer be allowed, but I believe there are other ways to solve that.. ie flash grenade, which no one seems to take seriously but I've never been a given a reason why. If flashes are too scary, maybe even a smoke grenade like was available on snow?
Since I see no one saying "I don't mind marathon matches let's keep doing things the same", it would be nice to see some suggestions on how to shorten matches other than apparently ridiculous suggestions of "No Gun Switching" and flash grenades.
Come on people! This is a time to be heard. Something new is being created and the more input from that is received from the community the better chance there will be that it is done right, and not given up on.
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mtnduman
TeamWarfare Vet
TWL Retired Staff
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| 11-07-2009 05:21 PM / profile
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I like the idea a flashes, but who would you give them too? Nader, knifer?
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snizz.
TWL Member
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| 11-07-2009 05:23 PM / profile
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.....
I say both!
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ghettogeddy
TeamWarfare Vet
TWL Retired Staff
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| 11-07-2009 05:40 PM / profile
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to be honest flashes would ruin the fun of gun game
maybe a round time limit
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